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 Ephemera Vs S-Club? Really?

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KosmoKhaos
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PostSubject: Ephemera Vs S-Club? Really?   January 3rd 2013, 3:54 am

So I saw T h i s P o s t on Tumblr last night and I'm actually rather shocked. It appears Ephemera thinks that S-Club has stolen his skins and used them as their own. really I can see big differences both in-game and out on their skins. They have two different styles, SClub's being more dolly/anime and TK(Ephemera)'s is a lot more realistic. TK may have jumped the gun on this one. He didn't bother to contact them for firsthand details on the accusations and I think that was a mistake on his part. They both highly respected and loved creators but with all the talent between LemonLeaf, AwT and Watermelon Field, I don't think they'd need to steal anything from anyone. What do you all think?


These picture's came from Ephemera's Post but LemonLeaf did her own comparison in the S-Club post (linked above)


These..I just don't understand why these were posted, as they look nothing alike at all. These were the previously released S-Club and Ephemera skins.
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PostSubject: Re: Ephemera Vs S-Club? Really?   January 3rd 2013, 4:15 am

I agree, Kosmo. I saw the post on tumblr and stared at the pictures until I was nearly cross-eyed, but I can't see how anyone could call it plagiarism. Their styles are completely different from each other. I have the highest respect for Ephemera as a skin creator, but I think he might have jumped the gun on this one. Plus, I think he should have went to S-Club privately instead of posting it on his blog...not cool.
There are alot of similarities, but there is also alot of differences, too. I hope they get past this and don't let the drama take over. Smile

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PostSubject: Re: Ephemera Vs S-Club? Really?   January 3rd 2013, 6:14 am

I agree also. I love lemonleaf's skins and they don't look nothing like Ephemera skins. sad
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PostSubject: Re: Ephemera Vs S-Club? Really?   January 3rd 2013, 9:26 am

It's unfortunate that these sorts of ordeals happen - especially because all of the creators involved in this are incredibly talented and have been continuously gracious in offering free creations to the community. I hope this doesn't cause anyone to become upset to the point of leaving the community, and that it can be resolved in a (hopefully) civil way. That being said, I understand that when you pour a lot of work into your creations, it's easy to get defensive.

If you take a look at LL's older skins - it's easy to see that S-Club's latest is simply a refined/more detailed version of those originals. The nose and mouth have changed quite a bit, but the placement has not changed one bit since LL's original skin was released. The eyelids are almost identical - the amount of dark "liner" has simply been reduced. Details on both the body and face were simply blended with Watermelon, since they have been working together as S-Club. LL's original skins came out aaaaages ago. So if their was "plagiarism" of Ephemera's work - it happened a long time ago, not now. In other words, nobody copied anyone.

As for stealing ideas - Watermelon was the first to release an "HQ" skin when she made her shiny bronze skin, M. Calero was probably the first to release a heavily textured/freckled skin, and the body freckle style that S-Club incorporated into their latest creation is inspired by both Orange's work and is something I've loved about Navetsea's skins since their first release (last year, sometime 2011?). Nobody "invented" these skin details and subsequently nobody stole them- and I've been so pleased with the variety that has been presented, especially in the last year of simming. I like it when creators take inspiration from one another - we get more options.

Rambling aside, I hope this gets resolved! I'll keep my fingers crossed.
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PostSubject: Re: Ephemera Vs S-Club? Really?   January 3rd 2013, 12:12 pm

is it some sort of east asian mentality? they are paranoid somebody would steal or plagiarized their works, then they will put password, close their blog, move it to some weird file sharing alternative, make it hard to get, only selected few are worthy to download their creations, childish imo.

but happen everytime, in sims, in elderscroll.... huge talent yet killed by a fragile ego.

everything we publicly release that is good enough will inspire other to follow, it is just reality, happens everywhere in every subject happen in car industries, happen in war tactics, happen in fashion industries, it will make us all improve.

I highly respect fellow skin creators since I also share the same passion, but it is ridiculous that somebody would burst into anger just because his lower eyelid and a small part around the back bone shading idea has been mimicked, but looking back into 2012 hasn't LL also publicly accused praline over some lipgloss ideas, so... this quote from S-club side
Quote :
But don’t waste too much time, as this is just a game, CC, is not that important, nor relevant to no one life.
apparently they don't live up to their own wise words.

sorry if I sound a little too provocative, but have seen enough dramas over this kind of thing and always happen in asian modding community, so I can't help not to mention it.
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PostSubject: Re: Ephemera Vs S-Club? Really?   January 3rd 2013, 2:54 pm

I whole-hardheartedly agree with Navetsea, especially on the points of "not living up to their own words". In general, I think some CC creators-- not just the Asian community, are very protective of their creations, which it totally understandable...

But when you take it to a public setting like S-club did, it's not necessary. It's borderline public humiliation and it should have been dealt with privately, in my opinion. But either way I also hope that they can sort the issue out and come to good terms. Sad...

EDIT;; Seems I had the situation ALL mixed up.
Quote :

On 1 Jan. 2013, I posted on my blog saying I felt there were some similarities between the lately published skin by LL, also several ones published before, and the new skin by me.

For me,there'is no necessary for LL to admit that she used my work as a reference. And if she has a resonable evidence to show those similarities are just a coincidence, then I will try to take it well.

Everytime when I published my creations I stressed that "Please DO NOT claim my creations as yours, and DO NOT modify my textures without permission .", but if my texture was used as material indeed, I will not investigate the relevant responsibility. But for sure I would like the information of the original author to be retained, and that's enough for me.
And this article mentioned the similarities can be seen here: http://blog.sina.com.cn/s/blog_63f63ea9010181m8.html

Then the next day, January 2, 2013, I wanted it can be more clear to explain the production process of my skin , I posted another bolg and here it is:
http://blog.sina.com.cn/s/blog_63f63ea9010182lx.html
(sorry for the blog was written in chinese, you can have a brife idea with the help of the assistance of the translator)

I'd never have guessed that lemon leaf, or S-Club,would accuse me for stealing their works instead, which seems completely nonsense. I have started making skins for sims since sims 2, there is no need for me to steal the work of someone (subaxi) whose first sims 3 skin was made with my sims 2 skin texture. Their evidence is that the publish times of my works are later than theirs, everytime when i post a new work(/ or creation), lemon leaf do will keep up closely with me.

At last,People doing any days on watching.

-Quoted from taru_k @ MTS-

This is frustrating, even though I'm not even involved. Sad
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PostSubject: Re: Ephemera Vs S-Club? Really?   January 3rd 2013, 5:07 pm

Really, TK's last statement is because LL apparently made some comments in HER explanation about how HIS skins sort of look like HER'S. I think this is all going out of control and one of them need to just be the bigger person and back down and come to some kind of truce or understanding. Both creators have SO much talent so why would either of them want to steal from one another?? It's ridiculous.
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PostSubject: Re: Ephemera Vs S-Club? Really?   January 3rd 2013, 9:04 pm

ugh. as if can read pages and pages of anything being posted ugh. and i have to say so much sims stuff look so much alike to me now.or usally. them skins are looking diff to me too , one so shiny buffed and other not so .ughhh

so much for fun.
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PostSubject: Re: Ephemera Vs S-Club? Really?   January 3rd 2013, 9:42 pm

upper & lower eyelid design is so sensitive, it is practically decided by how EA made their UV, a little missed placement will result in stretched blurry eyelids, and if both skin makers want to make same sort of eye bag feature on their skin, it is no wonder after sometime they will stumble into the same ideal positioning, because with trials and errors, they realize it is the most ideal place to have a good in game look.

The problem is they don't release their skin very often (at least compared to me... duhh :zelfmoord:*new* lol) so when finally they thought have found an ideal solution then they look at each other and wonder why other party seem to copy their works, because both creators doesn't show gradual steps they take to get there,

torso is a better canvas to express their creativity, since it has wider window for alternative designs.
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PostSubject: Re: Ephemera Vs S-Club? Really?   January 3rd 2013, 10:17 pm

i be pulling my hair out doing it for surre
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PostSubject: Re: Ephemera Vs S-Club? Really?   January 4th 2013, 3:41 pm

I don't think S-Club did steal stuff from Ephemera and incorporated it in their new skins. There's only so much you can do with the lines and position of the eyes, nose, mouth and rest of the body even.
I have both the new Ephemera and S-Club skins in my game, and I do think they're different, even when it comes to the eyes and stuff (I'm a sim creator, so I would definitely notice ! Razz).
Maybe it's an East Asian mentality of being paranoid, like navetsea suggested. Last time with Praline vs LL and WM they really blew things way out of proportion, in my opinion. I hope it doesn't come to that this time.
It's not fun and it can be really annoying and frustrating, but there will always be copycats and not only when it comes to Sims 3 creations, so I think we have to learn to live with that. I don't like copycats though !!

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PostSubject: Re: Ephemera Vs S-Club? Really?   January 4th 2013, 3:42 pm

When looking at both series of skins I second the idea from Navetsea that differences are quite subtle. I would rather have both artists agree that they stimulate each other in stead of accusing. We are not talking about great Art, paintings or inventions here but skins of a simulation game! (N.B. I have great respect for all Sims3 creators, don't get me wrong) So I hope both artists are capable of putting their ego's aside (sorry if my English fails) and come to their senses.
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PostSubject: Re: Ephemera Vs S-Club? Really?   January 4th 2013, 4:21 pm

This is all nonsense I'm glad we stick together here at Cstyles without drama :heart:
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PostSubject: Re: Ephemera Vs S-Club? Really?   January 4th 2013, 11:08 pm

Oh my...another mess. One which I hope gets cleared up nicely and soon. Here is my tiny two cents...I don't think we should label what ethnicity is the main culprit in claiming plagiarism...it's every ethnicity throughout the sims community. I see no direct similarity to the skins to say that one copied another...it's just not there. Like Eva...as a person who creates sims you learn to spot the differences in detail as you create. These two skins, make two sims, that would look exactly alike with ea skin, change with each skin. The eye detail Is not even that similar to me. With any skin you will always have some similarities as with any other custom content. However...I believe this might have been judged a bit too quickly and should have been handled a little better...quieter...amongst the two creator's.

Once something is blown out into the wide open it's harder to clean it up. I speak this from my own experience. I'm like this though...if one wants to close up their blog to only their few choice friends, then so be it, there are many more talented creator's to choose from. I do hope that this gets resolved and maybe even fences mended between the 2 creators.

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PostSubject: Re: Ephemera Vs S-Club? Really?   January 5th 2013, 3:16 am

there is tendency to Rage quit (or semi quit) and bring home all their nice toys and sulking for a very long time, only a circle of close friends are able to contact them and get their private releases... as if the whole world has to be punished as a side effect as their personal conflict,

and the worse part of such case is when they keep on teasing us by showing the screen capture or advertise the shiny new stuff that they have made and shared among close friends but not shared publicly to further punish the whole community to make lesson that we all should suffer because a single person has violated their sharing rules.... sad

well I hope it won't happen in this case... facepalm

oops sorry cece, I didn't mean to sound racist... cute wave I'm probably 75% chinese myself. hand dance
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PostSubject: Re: Ephemera Vs S-Club? Really?   January 6th 2013, 12:25 am

navetsea wrote:
there is tendency to Rage quit (or semi quit) and bring home all their nice toys and sulking for a very long time, only a circle of close friends are able to contact them and get their private releases... as if the whole world has to be punished as a side effect as their personal conflict,

and the worse part of such case is when they keep on teasing us by showing the screen capture or advertise the shiny new stuff that they have made and shared among close friends but not shared publicly to further punish the whole community to make lesson that we all should suffer because a single person has violated their sharing rules.... sad

well I hope it won't happen in this case... facepalm

oops sorry cece, I didn't mean to sound racist... cute wave I'm probably 75% chinese myself. hand dance


Nav in NO way did you sound racist!! Silly nilly!! Razz

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PostSubject: Re: Ephemera Vs S-Club? Really?   January 6th 2013, 1:32 am

oh well
that like what happened in sim2
and now some simmers dont share any sims at all eh
we will play without them im sure
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PostSubject: Re: Ephemera Vs S-Club? Really?   January 12th 2013, 11:58 am

Omg, there where some really long responses to this topic.

I haven't been on the sims in a week and all this happens Geez.

From looking at the posts I couldn't understand it cause Google translate sucks. But looking at the pics, I see the similarities but in game they are not the same at all.

Everyone said some valid points. I'm sure everyone agrees that what happened was not need PERIOD.

I think the creators don't realize how the are reacting right now.

To ban thier stuff from everyone sounds like a slippy slope, but its not like it isn't possible.

It is annoying to see a lot of screen captures of really cool stuff you can't have but that one them. They might as well not have a public blog at all.


I hope everything gets better.

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PostSubject: Re: Ephemera Vs S-Club? Really?   January 12th 2013, 6:09 pm

screen captures of simmies i love to have oh that can happen oh yes. lol . but i have lot of simmies in my game i hardly need more really. i do download more sim if i like it . i try to pick different faces though. and i try to collect dark sims when i can.
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